EP25: Stories from the Field: Creating Career Pathways Into Local Government

Intro 

What could happen if we take our workforce to new heights? Workforce on the Mic, presented by NAWDP, brings you inspirational stories, innovative solutions, and expert insights that are shaping the future of the workforce. Tune in for dynamic conversations that motivate and transform the workforce development community. And now, on to the episode. 

00:00:27 Alexis Franks 

Good morning, good afternoon, and good evening, all you workforce warriors across the country. 

My name is Alexis Franks, and I am your Director of Membership with the National Association of Workforce Development Professionals. 

And when we think about the infrastructure of our daily lives, everything from water coming out of our taps to the safety of our streets, and the development of our local economy, we’re really talking about the work of local government. It is the sector where rubber meets the road for community impact. 

And right now, local municipalities across the country are facing a crisis, a massive crisis. We’re seeing long-term and long-serving public servants reach an age where they are transitioning out of the workforce, and they’re leaving behind a gap in institutional knowledge with vacancies. 

So today in our episode, we’re exploring how we can turn this challenge into an opportunity and really work on building modern career pathways in local development and create some talent pipelines that actually work for public service in 2026. 

So to help us unpack this, I am joined today by Lindsay Lucas, Deputy Program Director with the Council of State Governments. Lindsay, welcome to you. 

00:01:57 Lindsay Lucas 

Thank you so much for having me on your podcast. So grateful to be able to join you to talk about something I’m very passionate about. 

00:02:05 Alexis Franks 

Awesome. We’re so glad to have you today. 

And what we do traditionally is pass the mic. So I’m going to pass the mic to you. And just to get us started, can you just tell us a little bit about the work that you do, where you are in the country, and how you’re serving in the public sector space? 

00:02:23 Lindsay Lucas 

Yes, I love to. So Alexis, as you mentioned, I’m Lindsay Lucas. I am the Deputy Program Director at the Council of State Governments, and I am located in our Washington, D.C. office. 

And I have the privilege and the honor to oversee our workforce and education portfolio, where I’m able to work with states and local government on ways to create more pathways into local government, into state government, into the public sector. 

And so that comes about in different ways by looking at policy. How are things set up to allow entry into a really great career opportunities for many people? How are trainings and education and opportunities made available to everyone in their communities that leads them into the public sector and create all those different pathways and pipelines into it. So I get to look at it from a different lens. 

I also look at from the lens of disability, like how are we supporting those with disabilities to enter into these really great career opportunities, really for our younger generation, our Gen Zers and our Alphas are coming up. 

So I love it, being able to kind of help government shape how they operate to allow more opportunities for people to enter into it. 

00:03:40 Alexis Franks 

That’s great. And it’s so important right now because of the need and the space that we’re in. We really want to create talent pipelines for every sector. 

And in thinking about state and local government, a lot of times that’s not the initial or priority industry or sector that we push when we’re working with youth or adult participants. 

But it’s so important to make sure that individuals in our communities consider it as a true career path. So the work that you’re doing, I’m sure, is definitely critical and needed right now. 

But if you can dig a little bit deeper, why is this moment so important for developing those strong talent pipelines into local government? 

00:04:26 Lindsay Lucas 

Yes. So you already kind of hinted at it that there’s a transition going on, right, where people, a lot of the individuals who are currently working for state and local government, they’re getting ready to transition and retire. 

And with that retirement, there’s going to be a loss of intentional knowledge and wisdom that they have gained over a period of time. And the fact is there’s not a lot more people coming into state and local government to kind of fill these gaps that we will be experiencing in the next few years. 

And so as states and governments is trying to navigate, well, what does it look like with a portion of our workforce transitioning out? How are we trying to make sure there is a space assistance set up to transfer knowledge between those who are retiring, those who are entering in, but also how are we making sure that we’re just adapting to critical issues. 

So it’s not just like we have people that are transitioning out. We also have communities that are being impacted differently due to the impact of technology modernization and AI. What does that look like? 

The impact of our climate changing, right? Like people maybe are experiencing more severe weather in certain areas than before. And like, how are they responding to that? 

Are there more individuals that need to go into a particular occupation in state and local government? How are states looking at providing public health services as well? 

And so there’s just like a generation of professionals that we need to step in and not only to take over, but also to lead and help states and government in general adjust to the changing dynamics, right? 

What we used to do 10, 15 years ago is not necessarily what’s needed, but we to do now and tomorrow. 

And not only that, I really want to emphasize that I don’t think people fully understand what government really does at the local and state level and how they impact every single aspect of our lives. And there’s so many different occupations that you can go into, and I think one thing that we do a disservice is really educating our younger population, our younger youth, whether that’s in, when they’re still in school, whether that’s middle school or high school, about like, what is the role of government? 

What are the opportunities there? And how that really plays a role in their own life and their families and different things like that. 

So I think right now is a real critical time for us to start having these conversations about how are we preparing this younger generation to step into spaces where they’re needed and it’s critical, and they’ll have a deep impact not on their lives, but on their community lives. 

00:07:18 Alexis Franks 

That is so interesting. And I’m actually kind of curious just for our listeners’ knowledge, for my own knowledge, are there any, I guess, state or local government departments that you can think of on the top of your head that may be some that are overlooked when we’re actually helping our participants consider other career paths and do that career exploration? 

I know this wasn’t part of our prep for this episode, but if there’s anything that we should be thinking about as professionals, we definitely want to hear from you. 

00:07:53 Lindsay Lucas 

No, this is actually a really great question. And it’s interesting because like when I go out to conferences and meet people, especially young people, they always ask me like, how did you get into the career that you’re in? I did not know that was an option for me. 

And then when I was talking about how, like for me, my background, I work for a county government in the state of Maryland, and I was talking about how I was able to have an impact on the budget process, on program development, implementation, and really understanding how the services that the county provided really dictated whether or not a person was able to receive the services they needed. 

And so I think when we think about what are the areas that people overlook, like people think of like, people, they repair the streets, the libraries. 

But I think you need to think bigger and broader. Like there’s a whole human resources department where you are navigating and working, interacting with people on a daily basis and making sure they’re set up for success in the workplace. 

There are individuals who literally, help design new spaces for communities to come together. Like you can be an architect and work for a local or state government. 

You can also oversee grounds over the parks, making sure they’re developed well, but also you can have an impact on community spaces whether there should be a park here or it’s okay to have a parking lot. 

You can also impact whether or not how buildings are constructed and do we have enough housing or should this be zoned a certain way? 

There’s so many different occupations that if you think about it in the private sector, the public sector is also doing it as well. And I think we need to lean into it. 

And I think an area that I think everyone’s talked about, of course, is the impact of AI and technology. And the thing is about AI, again, it’s a tool to use to help us to improve our own work. That’s going to be implemented throughout different occupations. 

And so understanding that even your skills with that are going to be critical down what other career path you choose. 

00:10:03 Alexis Franks 

That is so interesting. And I think we see these things every single day. We see parks, we go to lakes, we do all of these different things. 

But knowing that there’s an individual behind the work that’s being done or the individual that helps to create that space, that community space for use, as you mentioned, that is so interesting just to know and think about that as its own career path. That is something that our listeners can definitely take away, just to research and to really understand what’s available in their community. 

So let me go back because I know we’ve talked a little bit about the work that you’re doing with interest in young people transitioning into professions in local government. What are some of those misconceptions that maybe young professionals have about careers in local government? 

00:10:55 Lindsay Lucas 

I think people, when they think of government, they naturally think of the federal government. 

And I think when that comes, people think of bureaucracy and red tape and things may take a while to be implemented and be processed at the, but it’s different at the local and state level. Things actually can move quicker and it can be impactful. 

And so I do believe there is a misconception about like how quickly work can be done in the government sector. And so this kind of, demystifying that just a little bit. It can move quicker. 

It’s still government, so it’s not going to be as super fast as the private sector, but it’s not going to be at the level that you see at the federal level. 

Also, people also feel like maybe they need a specific degree or there’s like a narrow track to go into local government. Like I need to get a bachelor’s degree, I need to have a master’s, I need to understand the public sector in the full. 

I’m like, but that’s not true at all because there’s so many different occupations and so many different pathways into government that you do not need to believe you need a certain requirement to enter into it. 

Not only that, a lot of governments have professional development opportunities where once you get onto the job, they will train you for it. And you’ll be able to advance and really build a career with it. 

And so don’t think that it’s very narrow. We can only do a one type of job. It’s not just in the…it’s not just you going out and repaving the roads. There’s so much more that goes into it. 

And so I want to understand that it’s bigger than what you think. There’s a lot more opportunities there and a lot more growth. And also a lot of governments value their employees. And so they make a lot of investments in professional development that you may not understand or recognize until you’re actually in there. 

One thing that’s really interesting, I don’t think people will really realize is like government can be very innovative. And they love investing into like new programs and pilot programs and trying to see like how can we improve a system or a program or how can we respond to a need in the community in a very proactive way. 

So you have an opportunity to really have your impact come to the table with ideas and kind of see if it works or not. 

And so it’s really interesting seeing some of the really cool programs that come out of state government that are actually can be duplicated by other states, even the private sector and stuff like that. 

So I just want to put that out there. Like you will be amazed once you start going down that path. 

00:13:29 Alexis Franks 

That’s truly interesting. I know a lot of people may not think about those things, but those are pretty big things to consider, that there is a lot of innovation that is already currently happening, whether we hear about it on the day-to-day or not. 

But being in and a part of those processes can really impact the place where you live. And for a lot of young professionals or adult professionals, the place where you grew up and your family lives, and there’s so much change in all communities now, even in rural spaces. 

So what does that look like as you are thinking about a career path for yourself? I think those are all really big things to consider. 

And Lindsay, you mentioned a little bit about the work that you’ve done with young professionals, with individuals with disabilities. Do you have an example that you might be able to share with us of an initiative or something that has been successful for you all in bringing new talent into public service? 

00:14:32 Lindsay Lucas 

Yes, it’s thank you for asking that question because something I’m really excited about. We, I know I talk about we, the council state governments, love being able to provide and help states create pathways into local government. 

And part of that is looking at, well, what are the requirements first? And are they actually needed necessary? 

So you may have heard of some states actually getting rid of like requiring a bachelor’s degree for entry level positions and different things like that. And so we have seen states starting programs where there’s literally apprenticeship programs into local government, into state government, where you can go and get training to enter into different fields. 

And so it’s really cool to see that what’s happening in Maine, in Illinois, just many states are investing into apprenticeship programs. And again, that’s only one pathway. 

There’s also a lot of governments offer internships. Again, we’re all about pay to learn opportunities. 

Because I know, especially in, even though I’m talking about young people, this is applicable for anyone in any age group, right? 

If you want to transition from one career to the next, and you need to learn a couple of skills, but you also have fiscal responsibilities, you can’t always go back and get a degree, right? You can’t take on that additional financial burden. 

But there’s other programs that will actually provide you funding while you’re learning. And of course, apprenticeships is one of that, internships is one of that, 

And also like going into the trades we know which lead into also public sector is part of that. And so looking at fellowships, but also there’s community based organizations that also love to sponsor support. 

And so it’s also looking at in your state, in your community, what’s actually available for me? Where can I get support I need to enter into these pathways. 

So I love to call it specific programs, but I would love for people, if it’s Pacific state, Pacific community, to 1st just kind of see what’s going on at your local and state level about opportunities to learn and to enter into the profession. So always happy. 

And this is a quick shout out, like the Council of State Governments is working with the Urban Institute on a program where we’re actually helping states expand apprenticeship programs into the public sector because we are so invested in it and we’re so grateful that we were able to receive funding from a syndium group to really dive deep into this because we know there’s a great need and when we talk about apprenticeships, people haven’t really talked about it in the public sector way. So really excited for the work that’s coming out. 

00:17:07 Alexis Franks 

Yeah, that is truly exciting. And I was thinking in my mind, so I’m glad that you mentioned that. And I didn’t realize apprenticeships are available to those public sector occupations. 

So that’s a great alternative to going out and getting a degree for any professional that they have that ability to learn and earn at the same time. So I’m glad you shared that with us today. 

Again, for our listeners, that’s another point of just good information and research for you to really see what’s happening at your state and local level to see where the opportunity exists. 

And as we continue to look towards the future, Lindsey, and how things are changing in local and state governments, I love the lens that you’ve provided that on the policy side, even changing requirements to be able to get into these positions is an occupation in itself. So those are all big things to think about. 

But from your perspective, what skills would be most important for this next coming generation or the upcoming generation public servants, or even those that may be transitioning into these occupations. 

00:18:19 Lindsay Lucas 

Yeah, so before I start, just to let you know, like I am really big about researching, making sure I try to know as much as possible out there. So some of my thoughts, opinions are based off of me reading surveys that McKinsey and Company have done with the younger generations or with employers or with Pew Research who’ve also reached out. 

And one thing that I have noticed and even personally what I experience is that one key skill set is interpersonal skills, communication skills, being empathetic. 

And so I think we live in a time where everything’s very digital, very things via e-mail. And sometimes we forget about the human interaction piece. But that’s really critical, especially when you go into the public sector, because you’re there to serve others, you’re there to serve your community and make that impact, but you’re not able to communicate with them or your colleagues and understand and come to agreementbI think you’re not going to be as successful as you could be. 

And so making sure you really work on those skills, people refer to them as soft skills if you want to, but just making sure that you understand how to communicate and express yourself in a very healthy way. 

Also making sure you know how to write. And like when you’re doing outreach, when you’re doing emails, like the tone you set will have an impact, right? 

Especially because you, one thing I love about local government is like you can’t really do it alone. You need to do it in community, right? You need to have feedback literally from the residents. You need to have feedback from your team members or from the legislators or the elected officials. And so if you’re not able to bridge that gap or create relationships and build relationships, you’re going to find it a little bit difficult to get things done with. 

That is what I really want to lean into because I think everyone already knows about technology. 

I will admit I am a elder millennial and I kind of whispered that even though I’m on a podcast. So there is some technology I’m really great at because we just have to learn it, but there’s some technology and I’m like, do I really need to know this? 

And so having a younger generation or even people on my team that understand and navigate that and can help me and train me is incredible and very much needed. It’s a huge value add. 

And I think coming into a place and understanding that you have something to give to others and help others and understand that you’re having that impact, because again, studies and surveys have stated that this particular generation is really, they want to go into a job where they believe they are doing good. 

And I think there’s no other place than the public sector, when you really lean into that. And so kind of lean into that. 

And also, again, because you’re in the public sector and you’re usually responding to issues that may arrive is having problem solving and critical thinking skills. Again, just being able to assess what’s going on, navigate it, but also knowing when to ask for help and feedback. 

I think it takes more strength to ask for help or to admit that you need help than it does just to kind of push through and trying to figure it out. 

And so I think if you guys can lean in on those skills, I think you’re gonna be such a huge success when you grow in your career. 

00:21:49 Alexis Franks 

That is truly what we’ve heard across every single sector all the time, really having those soft skills, or we call them essential skills as well, because they truly are. 

It does not matter what industry or area you are in, what state or what part of the world, having that ability to communicate and build relationships and read and write and all of those things and comprehend information. Those are necessary in the success of any individual. 

So definitely, that’s great information too for those that may be transitioning from another sector or industry. Those are skills that can be easily transferable anywhere. 

So if you’re considering that change or if you’re working with customers or participants that are considering a change, those are things that they already have, may have built in their careers. So that may be an easier transition for them into the local government or state government occupations. 

And so Lindsay, you’ve given us a lot to consider today. I just have one more question for you as we’re wrapping up today.  

For our listeners who are a lot of workforce development professionals, they’re working with customers every single day. And some of those that may be trying to place their customers into those sectors or into those occupations. What advice can you give them who want to build for those who want to build a stronger partnership with their local government? 

00:23:21 Lindsay Lucas 

Yes, and like honestly, I am in awe of your members because they do such incredible work and they usually do it with not as much resources they wish they had or needed. And so I know this may be a little bit of a lift on their end and I accept that from the very beginning. 

But I think one critical piece is building relationships with the local government or their state government. I know it’ll take some time and effort. It’s not going to be something that happens overnight, but by reaching out, especially to their HR department, understanding what is going on, but also understanding like 

If you are feeling constraint due to budget situations, so is your government as well. And so understanding that and navigating that and understanding the flow of wind’s the best time to reach out, I think it’s going to be really great for you to understand. 

Also figuring out who your champions are. There are people at all levels of government, elected officials, or who work on the executive branch, who are invested in creating opportunities for young people to enter into the public sector. 

So who are those champions in your community, in your government, and lean on them and talk to them and go to the community meetings and raise your voice and have a conversation like, hey, I have a group of young people who want to go into work for you all. How can we make this happen? 

And just be persistent, which I know your members are. They do not give up. And I love that about them.So they just need to continue doing that. This with the local government, and I know it’s going to work out. And again, it’s all about relationships and partnerships there. 

Also lean on to other organizations who already may have a pathway or door open into local government. Let’s not reinvent the wheel. We don’t have time or the capacity to do that. So if we can lean on someone else, let’s do it.  

Also, check, like if you’re working with a population that’s still in school, whether it’s post-secondary or, you know, secondary, like maybe the schools have a partnership or relationship with local government or state government. So lean on them, help them help you to help the youth that you’re working with or the young people. 

And so I think there’s ways to go about it, but again, starting with the first step of this, like maybe having that conversation with that one champion. 

00:25:46 Alexis Franks 

Well, Lindsay, you have given us a lot of good information today and usually what we have on workforce on the mic or mic drop moments. 

So you gave us a few mic drop moments today. Definitely do your research, build those essential skills or notice and really highlight those essential skills for the customers that you’re working with. And engage with your state and local government. Build those relationships, engage the HR department or other champions in the community that may have the access to get individuals into these occupations. 

So, Lindsay, thank you for sharing this information with us today. Hopefully, our listeners can take something away that they can implement in their day-to-day work. 

And if anyone would like to learn a little bit more about the Council of State Governments, what is the best way for them to do that? 

00:26:38 Lindsay Lucas 

They can either go to our website, which is csg.org, or they can reach out to me. 

They can e-mail me directly. My e-mail address is lucas@csg.org. 

And I look forward to hearing from you all. 

And again, thank you, Alexis, for having me and NAWDP for having me on this amazing podcast. Again, I’m in awe of your members. So this is a true honor for me. 

00:27:00 Alexis Franks 

Thank you, Lindsay. Thank you so much for joining us today. We look forward to continuing to engage with you and see the work that you’re doing. 

00:27:08 Lindsay Lucas 

Thank you. 

00:27:09 Alexis Franks 

Before we wrap up, make sure to register for the upcoming NAWDP Business Services Academy. 

This event is specifically designed to equip workforce professionals with the advanced tools, business engagement strategies, and pipeline development skills needed to better serve local employers. 

Spaces fill up fast, so head over to www.nawdp.org today to secure your spot. 

00:27:44 Conclusion 

Thank you for listening to Workforce on the Mic, presented by NAWDP. Make sure to subscribe to the podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. 

To learn more about NAWDP and to become a member, visit www.nawdp.org. That’s www.nawdp.org.